Author Topic: Things That Annoy You in Fanfiction  (Read 15664 times)

Cherry Lover

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #30 on: August 04, 2013, 01:55:31 AM »
Yeah, I have to agree with Xamusel here. It's extremely common.

And, honestly, in certain circumstances there really aren't many ways to show a character is strong. If you're dealing with heroes who are strong, then the only way to make a villain seem like a credible threat is to have it take on someone previously shown to be strong and having them come out on top. Otherwise people just say "well, they've not actually done anything".

Xamusel

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #31 on: August 04, 2013, 01:58:35 AM »
Oh, really, lantz?

Name ten authors of fanfics that don't do this (and fifteen authors of original stuff as well).

@Cherry: Exactly! That's the main thing about The Worf Effect that makes it worth use by most everyone.

Cherry Lover

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #32 on: August 04, 2013, 02:01:17 AM »
Whilst I agree with you, I'm not sure I could name 10 fanfic authors full stop (at least off the top of my head), so I think that's a bit of an unfair thing to ask.

Xamusel

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #33 on: August 04, 2013, 02:06:25 AM »
Actually, I just wanted to know if lantz could back up his statement about the good writers not resorting to The Worf Effect, and that would mean that I would have to check said authors out personally to see if they are as good as he claims.

I honestly made up that number because I saw the whole "name 5" thing to be over-used.

Tyrnek

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #34 on: August 04, 2013, 02:50:12 AM »
It'd be interesting to get some opinions on what authors could do to establish someone as a threat without having to worf a character.

The only thing I can think of off the top of my head is blowing up a city/continent/planet, but that has its own inherent problems.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2013, 03:41:57 AM by Tyrnek »

Xamusel

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #35 on: August 04, 2013, 03:41:35 AM »
Yeah, I can agree about the blowing things up part, that's more problematic than it's worth.

Cherry Lover

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #36 on: August 04, 2013, 05:31:06 PM »
Well, it's kind-of the same thing in any case, only it tends to turn the villain into a complete monster, which might not be the intention. Plus, not all villains are even capable of that.

Tyrnek

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #37 on: August 04, 2013, 08:51:19 PM »
True.

Unfortunately, asides from Worfing or Destroyer or Worlds, there really isn't that much I can think of to justify a new villain being a threat. Maybe he's been pulling the strings this whole time, or he does a terrorist thing with bombs, or he murders some secondary character who is ancillary to the plot, or Red Shirting happens, or we find out that he's somehow in control of an entire private army, or something. Telling the readers that he's a threat is obviously not going to work.

I don't know, maybe I'm just not being very creative right now.

lantzblades

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #38 on: August 05, 2013, 12:19:50 AM »
Ubw is a perfect way to show a character being powerful without worfing them, you need not take out the biggest guy effortlessly to prove a character's ability

Cherry Lover

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #39 on: August 05, 2013, 01:29:40 AM »
It depends how powerful you are.

In HF, the whole point is that the shadow is basically unstoppable. For that to make sense it has to take out the servants. Particularly since they have to be dead for the story to happen. That wasn't any more the Worf effect than Rider dying in UBW is. It's just part of the plot.

lantzblades

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #40 on: August 06, 2013, 08:11:50 AM »
No, you're right, the word effect while cheesy and stupid only ever did it once an episode and not in succession allowing worf to keep his dignity. The shadow and hf's plot on the other hand are bad writing plain and simple. There's no need to kill characters, it was a choice and it was also a choice to make the shadow punk them all. Bad writing especially for the routes preceding events.

Cherry Lover

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #41 on: August 06, 2013, 03:39:20 PM »
No, for HF to work the servants did need to be killed-off. They're not the focus of events and Shirou etc. didn't have the time to go around fighting them.

lantzblades

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #42 on: August 07, 2013, 06:38:11 PM »
They didn't need to die that way, they could have fought each other and been beaten that way

Cherry Lover

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #43 on: August 07, 2013, 06:45:33 PM »
They didn't need to die that way, they could have fought each other and been beaten that way

Not given the timetable of the route. Plus, Zouken and the shadow would hardly be a convincing villain if all they could do was kill civilians....

Also, they weren't simply "Worfed", Lancer and Berserker put up quite a fight, Assassin's death was necessary for TA to come out and Caster was tricked by Zouken.

lantzblades

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Re: Things that annoy you in fanfiction discussion thread
« Reply #44 on: August 13, 2013, 09:44:34 AM »
TA was a sacrifice kill, it's a. Mechanical death, it's not bad writing, as for the timetable excuse that doesn't hold water given how fast servants are, it's unlikely a servant fight would extend beyond an hour.