Author Topic: Fanfic ideas thread  (Read 5415 times)

Cherry Lover

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Fanfic ideas thread
« on: May 19, 2013, 03:10:14 AM »
OK, this is a thread for discussing TM fanfiction ideas.

I have a couple of things I've been thinking of, and need to flesh out. The first is a story which follows initially along the UBW route, but diverges when Shinji is killed instead of Rider, forcing Rider back into Sakura's control. My eventual intention for it is for Sakura to be forced into the war, and for it to develop such that Shirou is paired with Sakura and Rin with Archer. But, I'm not sure how to make it develop in that direction, and I could do with some help.

Another idea I had a while back (although it's admittedly been kind-of done in various places since I first had the idea) was for a story in which Zouken is somehow "purified" in the third war by some AU servant, causing him to revert to being a normal old man, and realise some of the horrible stuff he's done. He's still somewhat of a dick, but within normal magus bounds, and he's now interested in passing on his family magecraft in a normal manner rather than immortality for himself.

As a result, he raises Kariya as a magus and, since the family magic doesn't involve worm-rape, he doesn't run away like in canon, and inherits the Matou family leadership when Zouken dies (some time prior to him reaching adulthood). Even so, Aoi still marries Tokiomi, and has Sakura and Rin, but she remains close friends with Kariya (even more so than in canon). When it comes to the point where Tokiomi realises he needs someone to adopt Sakura, Kariya is the natural choice, since Aoi trusts him, he's an allied family (who needs an heir much like in canon) and he is in this timeline more conscious of the usual magus mindset (although he's still a nice guy, and cares deeply for the girls as people).

Since Zouken has brought him up to be a magus, Kariya does actually desire to pass on the family magic, and thus does take on Sakura for the benefit of the family as well as for her own benefit, and he therefore does train her as a Matou magus to some extent (which is likely to be somewhat painful). However, he also loves her like he would his own daughter, and hates the fact that he is causing her pain sometimes.

As a result, whilst her training is sometimes harsh, he is always there to comfort her, and he always tries to give her a choice and to make her life generally happy, as well as making it up to her after the training by giving her rewards. Basically, he's much more of a magus than in canon and is still trying to turn her into the Matou heir or someone who will produce an heir, but unlike Zouken he genuinely cares for her well-being in the same way as Tokiomi cares for Rin's, and wants her to have a successful and ideally happy life in her own right, rather than just being a pawn for the continuation of the family.

Also, he does try to create an alliance between his family and the Tohsakas, reasoning that it's in both of their best interests, and also not wanting the sisters to be seperated more than necessary. It's likely that he would fight alongside Tokiomi in the fourth war, as allies. Tokiomi would still die, and Rin would be raised by Aoi, but it's possible that Kariya would marry her after Tokiomi's death, reuniting the sisters. If not Rin and Sakura would be very close, and Sakura would probably stay overnight at Aoi's regularly, being encouraged by Kariya to refer to her as her mother (and Rin as her sister). They would therefore go into the fifth war as allies, although they would both desire to win the Grail in their own right. Admittedly, I'm not sure where to actually take this story yet, it just seems like an interesting setting....

So, what do you think of these ideas? Any ideas on how to make them work, or what to do with them? Any ideas of your own?

lantzblades

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2013, 08:38:56 PM »
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I have a couple of things I've been thinking of, and need to flesh out. The first is a story which follows initially along the UBW route, but diverges when Shinji is killed instead of Rider, forcing Rider back into Sakura's control. My eventual intention for it is for Sakura to be forced into the war, and for it to develop such that Shirou is paired with Sakura and Rin with Archer. But, I'm not sure how to make it develop in that direction, and I could do with some help.

if i recall caster kills rider. in that that case you have to think about how she does that and what she knows.

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Another idea I had a while back (although it's admittedly been kind-of done in various places since I first had the idea) was for a story in which Zouken is somehow "purified" in the third war by some AU servant, causing him to revert to being a normal old man, and realise some of the horrible stuff he's done. He's still somewhat of a dick, but within normal magus bounds, and he's now interested in passing on his family magecraft in a normal manner rather than immortality for himself.

As a result, he raises Kariya as a magus and, since the family magic doesn't involve worm-rape, he doesn't run away like in canon, and inherits the Matou family leadership when Zouken dies (some time prior to him reaching adulthood). Even so, Aoi still marries Tokiomi, and has Sakura and Rin, but she remains close friends with Kariya (even more so than in canon). When it comes to the point where Tokiomi realises he needs someone to adopt Sakura, Kariya is the natural choice, since Aoi trusts him, he's an allied family (who needs an heir much like in canon) and he is in this timeline more conscious of the usual magus mindset (although he's still a nice guy, and cares deeply for the girls as people).

Since Zouken has brought him up to be a magus, Kariya does actually desire to pass on the family magic, and thus does take on Sakura for the benefit of the family as well as for her own benefit, and he therefore does train her as a Matou magus to some extent (which is likely to be somewhat painful). However, he also loves her like he would his own daughter, and hates the fact that he is causing her pain sometimes.

As a result, whilst her training is sometimes harsh, he is always there to comfort her, and he always tries to give her a choice and to make her life generally happy, as well as making it up to her after the training by giving her rewards. Basically, he's much more of a magus than in canon and is still trying to turn her into the Matou heir or someone who will produce an heir, but unlike Zouken he genuinely cares for her well-being in the same way as Tokiomi cares for Rin's, and wants her to have a successful and ideally happy life in her own right, rather than just being a pawn for the continuation of the family.

Also, he does try to create an alliance between his family and the Tohsakas, reasoning that it's in both of their best interests, and also not wanting the sisters to be seperated more than necessary. It's likely that he would fight alongside Tokiomi in the fourth war, as allies. Tokiomi would still die, and Rin would be raised by Aoi, but it's possible that Kariya would marry her after Tokiomi's death, reuniting the sisters. If not Rin and Sakura would be very close, and Sakura would probably stay overnight at Aoi's regularly, being encouraged by Kariya to refer to her as her mother (and Rin as her sister). They would therefore go into the fifth war as allies, although they would both desire to win the Grail in their own right. Admittedly, I'm not sure where to actually take this story yet, it just seems like an interesting setting....

the biggest issue I can see is the implausibility of this idea. it's nice but considering the other elements of canon (namely Kiritsugu) at the very least Shirou would never be friends with Rin and sakura. I still think kairya surviving is unlikely but if so then certainly shirou won't be friends with them.

Cherry Lover

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2013, 08:47:29 PM »
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I have a couple of things I've been thinking of, and need to flesh out. The first is a story which follows initially along the UBW route, but diverges when Shinji is killed instead of Rider, forcing Rider back into Sakura's control. My eventual intention for it is for Sakura to be forced into the war, and for it to develop such that Shirou is paired with Sakura and Rin with Archer. But, I'm not sure how to make it develop in that direction, and I could do with some help.

if i recall caster kills rider. in that that case you have to think about how she does that and what she knows.

Well, the easiest solution is for her to kill Shinji rather than what she did in canon, which was to force him to make Rider suicide.

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the biggest issue I can see is the implausibility of this idea.

In what way? I mean, that's a damn big issue....

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it's nice but considering the other elements of canon (namely Kiritsugu) at the very least Shirou would never be friends with Rin and sakura.

Why?

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I still think kairya surviving is unlikely but if so then certainly shirou won't be friends with them.

Why is Kariya surviving so unlikely? He's not an idiot, and he won't get backstabbed by Kotomine.

lantzblades

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2013, 09:01:30 PM »
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Why?

Kiritsugu wouldn't trust them and shirou would grow up with that bias ingrained in him.

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Why is Kariya surviving so unlikely? He's not an idiot, and he won't get backstabbed by Kotomine.

happening as per canon kiritsugu is the magus killer, he was fairly ruthless, that's why it's unlikely here with the two families being allies.

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Well, the easiest solution is for her to kill Shinji rather than what she did in canon, which was to force him to make Rider suicide.

makes sense and she wouldn't contract rider.

Cherry Lover

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2013, 09:14:29 PM »
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Why?

Kiritsugu wouldn't trust them and shirou would grow up with that bias ingrained in him.

That doesn't seem very Shirou-like to me. He's way too trusting and, in any case, Kiritsugu deliberately avoided telling him anything about Magi or the Grail War, so there's no reason to believe he'd tell him anything here either.

And, even if that were the case, they would almost certainly end up bumping into each other and allying during the war.

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Why is Kariya surviving so unlikely? He's not an idiot, and he won't get backstabbed by Kotomine.

happening as per canon kiritsugu is the magus killer, he was fairly ruthless, that's why it's unlikely here with the two families being allies.

Yes, Kiritsugu was ruthless, but that doesn't mean he'd be able to off Kariya. He was actually pretty smart about hiding himself, and survival would be important to him because Sakura can't train herself as easily as Rin can due to not being a Matou.

And, whilst he would try to get him during the war, if he survived it Kiritsugu wouldn't hold a grudge. He would just keep out of Kariya's way.

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Well, the easiest solution is for her to kill Shinji rather than what she did in canon, which was to force him to make Rider suicide.

makes sense and she wouldn't contract rider.

Well, the minute Shinji dies Rider vanishes and returns to her true master, as she does when the book is burnt in HF. Caster wouldn't expect that at all, so she wouldn't be prepared for it even if she did want Rider.

The question is where the story goes from there....

lantzblades

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2013, 10:19:27 PM »
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That doesn't seem very Shirou-like to me.

he's not an idiot. they were enemies in the war and he knows what magi are. he would definately not trust them.

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And, even if that were the case, they would almost certainly end up bumping into each other and allying during the war.

I somehow doubt that

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Yes, Kiritsugu was ruthless, but that doesn't mean he'd be able to off Kariya.

i said unlikely, not impossible.

Cherry Lover

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2013, 10:25:44 PM »
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That doesn't seem very Shirou-like to me.

he's not an idiot. they were enemies in the war and he knows what magi are. he would definately not trust them.

The exact same logic applies in canon, though, and yet Shirou never has the slightest issue trusting either Sakura or Rin.

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And, even if that were the case, they would almost certainly end up bumping into each other and allying during the war.

I somehow doubt that

Given Shirou's nature and how Sakura and Rin would end up in this timeline, they would. Even if Shirou wouldn't trust them instantly, he's not someone who refuses to give people a chance, and nor is he a murderer. Further, in this timeline Sakura and Rin would end up nicer than in canon, because Rin would have a mother (but not Tokiomi) and both girls would have Kariya encouraging their human side (although he wouldn't expect them to neglect their magus side either), as well as each other.

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Yes, Kiritsugu was ruthless, but that doesn't mean he'd be able to off Kariya.

i said unlikely, not impossible.
[/quote]

I find it entirely plausible, honestly.

lantzblades

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2013, 10:29:41 PM »
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The exact same logic applies in canon, though, and yet Shirou never has the slightest issue trusting either Sakura or Rin.

the situation is vastly different here then there.

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Given Shirou's nature and how Sakura and Rin would end up in this timeline, they would.

much later perhaps but i think saber would warn him off.

Cherry Lover

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2013, 10:46:46 PM »
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The exact same logic applies in canon, though, and yet Shirou never has the slightest issue trusting either Sakura or Rin.

the situation is vastly different here then there.

How is it, from his viewpoint?

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Given Shirou's nature and how Sakura and Rin would end up in this timeline, they would.

much later perhaps but i think saber would warn him off.

Why would she warn him off any more than in canon? To her there is actually no difference, since she can't see what happened in the 10 years between the wars.

lantzblades

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2013, 11:14:38 PM »
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How is it, from his viewpoint?

he'd be more untrusting because of having an example in front of him

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Why would she warn him off any more than in canon?

he'd trust her more busy he would know more.

Cherry Lover

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2013, 11:38:27 PM »
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How is it, from his viewpoint?

he'd be more untrusting because of having an example in front of him

What?

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Why would she warn him off any more than in canon?

he'd trust her more busy he would know more.

Why would he?

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2013, 08:41:15 PM »
he would be raised differntly given that the land owners would know about kiritsugu, he would be told to keep his magic secret and not to associate with the Tohsaka's.

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2013, 11:13:15 PM »
Why would the land owners know about Kiritsugu? And, even if they did, I see no reason to assume that he would need to keep his magic secret. Indeed, them knowing about him would make it more necessary for him to interact with them.

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2013, 02:49:30 AM »
Kariyawas a former master, he'd know. As a result he would deny training shirou and tell shirou to keep it a secret from the tohsaka's

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Re: Fanfic ideas thread
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2013, 03:07:43 AM »
Kariyawas a former master, he'd know.

So what?

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As a result he would deny training shirou and tell shirou to keep it a secret from the tohsaka's

He doesn't tell them anything in canon either. I don't see him considering not having Shirou talk to the Tohsakas important enough to act any differently with regard to Shirou's training (or, rather, the lack thereof). He doesn't want Shirou to become a magus or to have anything to do with magic, really, telling him to keep it secret from the Tohsakas is counter-productive in that respect.